Crash if VIDEO_TS already exists?

[0xdeadbeef]

I just wonder: does DVDStripper crash if the destination folder is not empty and contains e.g. a VIDEO_TS folder?
Because this would be the only explanation I can think of for the crash I just got. And yes, this was the first time I used DVDStripper.

Pretty annoying that the programs just exits and doesn't give me any chance to try again without ripping the DVD again.

BTW: the DVD I tried (Godzilla) is obviously not ripped completely. At least it's not possible to open the ripped files with e.g. DVDShrink oder Nero Recode. It hard to say what is missing because of the strange structure that DVDStripper creates...

Very disappointing start to say the least.

 

[MackemX]

What version are you using? as I think I have just sent you the Beta 2 which should have noticed if the destination folder contains data. It will tell you it contains data and ask if you want to delete it

Can you explain more as to what the crash was. It will display an error normally with a number and description. When did it happen and what was it doing at the time?

DVDShrink or NeroRecode will only read the files DVDStripper produces

it's bound to be dissapointing if you experience an error first time but I'm sure there is a simple answer

 

[0xdeadbeef]

What version are you using? as I think I have just sent you the Beta 2 which should have noticed if the destination folder contains data. It will tell you it contains data and ask if you want to delete it

Can you explain more as to what the crash was. It will display an error normally with a number and description. When did it happen and what was it doing at the time?

DVDShrink or NeroRecode will only read the files DVDStripper produces

it's bound to be dissapointing if you experience an error first time but I'm sure there is a simple answer

I'm using 0.2.0 ß2.
The message box appeared exactly as I pressed the "process" button.The destination folder was "D:\dvd" which didn't contain any files, but 4 subdirectories (including VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS).
Sorry, I clicked the message box away without writing down the exact message or number. And I'm not keen on ripping the DVD again just to reproduce the error.
However, I made second try with the exact same setting except for a different destination folder (without existing VIDEO_TS/AUDIO_TS in it). This time it worked, so I'm quite sure it's the presence of the directories that caused the first crash.

I'm a bit disappointed because I was not aware that processing is not possible without ripping. Also I miss the title numbers etc. known from tools like DVDShrink. I hoped DVDStripper was just a processing tool that reads from a HD folder and writes to a HD folder. Having the possibility to rip is a nice feature, but being forced to rip is a major drawback IMHO.
Up to know I ripped with DVDShrinker, then browsed with DVDShrink to find out what to delete and then deleted/trancoded with IC8. Sometimes did some processing with IfoEdit before or after IC8.
All I wanted and needed was a tool that makes the IfoEdit process more easy and secure. Just a simple tool that would let me select title x from vts y and remove it without destroying the VOB structure.
Instead DS forces me to complicate the whole browsing/ripping stage:
Compared to browsing with DVDShrink, analyzing the DVD with DVDStripper is a pain. Neither can I browse the (temporary) ripped folder with DVDShrink nor could I use the title numbers within DVDStripper since for some obscure reasons it has a unique numbering scheme. And again: having no possibility to rip and process in two independent stages makes DVDStripper nearly useless for me since I have to analyze the DVD before the stripping and decide whether to use DS or not.

 

[MackemX]

I've just simulated what you say and created the VIDEO_TS/AUDIO_TS folders in my Backup folder and it worked just fine . It does not recognise folders only files. It only looks for IFO/BUP/VOB's and will leave anything else as I also put files in the 2 folders as well as the Destination folder itself

it should be impossible to continue if any of the TEMP/DEST/BACKUP folders contain any of these 3 types of files. It only gives the option to delete the files and if you press cancel it will just stop

I'm sorry you didn't realise that it needs to rip the files but it tells you on the www.dvdstripper.com what most of the process involves. I also ask in the Notes that people ask questions or browse through the forums first so they have all the answers to their questions

it is best to rip the DVD again as you do not know how people have pre-ripped the DVD and therefore cannot guarantee it will work, whereas ripping direct from the DVD will ensure a fresh clean rip

agreed DVDShrink allows preview from the DVD, but how many other programs require you to rip the DVD first unless you use something like ANYDVD etc?

have you read the user guide that was enclosed in version 0.1.1?. There is also a guide in this thread HERE showing you how to use the Title selector as that shows you the Title numbers, which you look like you have missed

please read the guides if you haven't already done so as most information is in them and this will give you a better idea on how to use DVDStripper

if you still have questions just ask

 

[Arianos]

Just a few thoughts, in random order:
1. EVERY DVD-editing program requires ripping. Do you moan on the WAY it get's ripped? By changing Working folders, I now have three different projects on my HDs
Your words:
All I wanted and needed was a tool that makes the IfoEdit process more easy and secure. Just a simple tool that would let me select title x from vts y and remove it without destroying the VOB structure.
Uhm, that's exactly what DS does!!!! I'm confused:
it rips:
ifoedit needs you to rip. You can't escape that part in ANY program
it previews better than ifoedit. You can choose any viewer!
and it rebuilds auto for you
What could be simpler???
2. I agree DVDShrink's preview is fantastic, but it's also UNIQUE and IMHO, it doesn't do such a fantastic transcoding job.
3. Making Ifoediting easy? well here the answer doesn't need any explaining Ifoediting has NEVER been easier. So now you have to change your way of thinking (transcoding procedure) a little. Just like buying a new car: The windshiled wipers are in a different place, or the 5th gear is different, but it's still a car!
4. Even after a crashing, chances are you can use Ifoedit recovery, so basically you DON"T have to rip again.
5. I partially aggree on having to go through all the items to find the ones u don't want can be a hassle, but then, I'm spolied rotten since the old days. But then again, what is a better way to do slecting title u want to get rid of? Maybe DS to preselect unwanted titles for you?. That's a Feature request! Take away even the 5 minutes of time needed to get rid of titles.
6. Now i always use DS even on a DVD5s. Some companies have some extremely annoying screens before or immediately after the Main Menu, that I simply HAVE to destroy!. And with the new version they are gone and forgotten in a flash and dont even show a blank screen!
Try to find THAT feature in any other semi-automatic program
7. Reading the manual is never a bad idea, since we now have Title selection, a long awaited addition to an already great program, which makes it similar, at least to your repeatedly favourite, DVDShrink A

But in the end it works OK for you? Right?

 

[0xdeadbeef]

I can somehow understand that both of you defend the way DS works, however I as a user still want a tool to help me instead of adapting my way of working to a tool. It would be perfectly nice if DS would allow me to do the ripping, but it's a nuisance that it forces me to. I would complain about e.g. DVDShrink the same way if ripping was not a feature but a must. Who wouldn't?

Indeed, since ripping is a somewhat boring process, I (now) usually rip 2 or 3 DVDs a in row, then maybe the next day I analyze the first one with DVDShrink, decide what to eliminate and so on.
But now DS forces me to decide directly after ripping each DVD what exactly I have to remove. Compared to my former workflow where I could analyze the DVDs as long and often as I wanted, this is a step back into the middle ages. Not to mention that I have to select from within DS where I can't even see if there are large dts sound tracks or director's comments or whatever which I need to consider before ripping extras. So now DS forces me to analzye the DVD before even starting DS. Since I can't even analyze the temporary folder DS copied the ripped file to, I have to analyze the DVD directly with DVDShrink which I never had to before.

About the title selection: Nero, DVDShrink and IC8 all have the same way of title numbering. Title3 in DVDShrink is Title3 in IC8 as is Menu3 etc. It's still a complete mystery to me, why DS uses a proprietary numbering scheme.
If the analysis and preview function in DS would be somewhat comparable to that of DVDShrink, I wouldn't care as much, but unfortunately it's not. Since neither the menu items are sorted for languages nor the movie titles are sorted into main movie / extras entries, it's much more of a hassle to analyse complex DVDs concerning which items to remove and which to keep.

Sure, DS seems to work perfectly (apart from that strange invalid path crash) if I adapt to its workflow, but that's nothing I really want to do without an urgent need.

PLEASE consider support of files aready ripped to the HD and the use of the common numbering scheme before you add any new features that I don't really need. I still have a slight hope that DS might become the tool I waited for so long.

 

[MackemX]

DS isn't forcing you to analyze the disc. How do you know if you want anything removing without 1st playing the DVD? Forgive me but I just don't understand what point you are trying to make as the majority of all DVD backup software requires you to either play or rip the DVD initially

You can rip as many DVD's as you want as you do not have to process them immediately. I think Arianos mentioned he had 3 project folders and he will probably be processing them at another time. Try it, rip the files then close DS and restart DS but make sure that your Temporary path is pointing to a previously DS ripped DVD. Also make sure that your backup & destination paths are valid. Click NEXT instead of the Rip button and you will then get a list of all the files that are in that folder and you are back to where you where just after you ripped them. In time there will probably be a project option so you just select the project and it will load it all for you

your issue regarding titles, by the sounds of things you still have not used the VTS title selector. If the DVD has 10 titles as shown in DVD Shrink and the main movie is say title 4 then those 10 titles will be shown in DS's Titles selector window and the main movie will be title 4. In IC, if a title is linked in any way then it forces you to remove all of the linked titles or none whereas DS allows you to selectively remove titles without affecting the links. Each title in DS will be exactly the same as the ones shown in DVDShrink/IC or any other program that lists titles. The order may be different but the titles will be exactly the same. The only thing it doesn't do is tell you what the main movie title is. It does tell you the playback time and amount of chapters and most movie titles will stick out like a sore thumb

DS is a video content stripper whereas DVDShrink isn't as it's mainly a compressor and vice versa. I do not know why you keep comparing it to DVDShrink. You would use DVDShrink afterwards as many users do, to remove any audio and compress if neccessary as DS doesn't do this and doesn't claim to

it has very few similarities regarding features when comparing to Shrink but most who use DS's latest Beta find it easy now. The title selector has made it a lot easier than it was before and it's so much easier than manual stripping methods which require a lot of time/effort/expertise, which is what DS is meant to eliminate by doing it all for the user

You may need to use DS a little more than a couple of times to get used to it and it's possible uses as you are still very new to all this. It shouldn't take that much adapting once you get the feel of it. You even said yourself it works perfectly which is one pleasing thing to hear

 

[Arianos]

Sorry to have sounded a little upset, but this complaining-moaning about DS has started getting to me. Nothing personal though.
Let's have some history:
People have been trying to modify DVDs while doing backups since day one. There are countless sites and threads in many forums for ways to do so. 99.9 % of the methods require moderate to expert ability to use Ifoedit, and the luxury for the users to have an ample amount of time on their hands. They also require the making of a lot of coasters, or, many DVD-RWs for testing. In the meantime, people have been asking for a tool that could automate things, even a little. Things started lightening up, when Menuedit started not being just a menuediting tool. But even then, it required manual user ifoedit input, which could lead to 'unwanted' results for newbies. Then DS appeared, aggreed under not the best of conditions, and instead of people being 100% supportive, many jumbed on it and it's authors. Is there a doubt that it's a 'black sheep' over at Doom9 forum? Every mention of it is monitored, and one prays he doesn't get on a Mod's bad side.
DS has constantly an ear out for user input, and almost al suggestions have been implemented, and then some. Every individual case with troubles is looked after. And it's on it's third public release, two of them betas! Now, do you know many commercial programs that do that?
The most sought after feature, was title selection, and it's already implemented.
EVERY transcoder has it's own unique way or operating, and it's idiosyncrasies. (since you keep comparing it to DVDShrink, which IMHO, is like comparing apples with oranges). I still remember a thread, where a guy wanted DVD2ONE to have the audio streams already checked when setting up the project, because he was too careless to check them manually, and ended up with no sound Now THAT was a case of RTFM, if I ever saw one!
Now you keep complaining about Title selection, and MX has told you twice that it's ALREADY THERE, and you still complain about it.
Uhm, what else can he do?
The only thing that cannot be done is switch on the fly between DS and Shrink, but why would anyone want to do that? Even you say that you want it to 'see' what titles to get rid of. Isn't the cell preview within the title good enough? I'm sorry, you lost me here.
You say:
however I as a user still want a tool to help me instead of adapting my way of working to a tool. It would be perfectly nice if DS would allow me to do the ripping, but it's a nuisance that it forces me to. I would complain about e.g. DVDShrink the same way if ripping was not a feature but a must. Who wouldn't?
If DS was a transcoder, I would agree with you 100%. But it's not, so it's not comparable. It's a step before transcoding, to put it roughly. One would rip the DVD anyway. EVERY program forces you to rip. So it's done in a different way. What's the big deal? After DS is finished, you have a VIDEO_TS folder to preview any way you want. You can even use Shrink to preview from the DVD-Rom if you want, note what you don't want, then proceed with DS, get rid of stuff SAFELY AND EASY, and then open Shrink again. Is that 'adaptation' too much?
You say:
PLEASE consider support of files aready ripped to the HD and the use of the common numbering scheme before you add any new features that I don't really need. I still have a slight hope that DS might become the tool I waited for so long.
Part two is already answered, part one is a problem, agreed, BUT only if you already have files on your HD and have no means of re-ripping. But even then, you can always use IMGtools, make an image, mount it and then rip again the DS way. All in all, it's half an hour drawback, and problem solved.
Sorry about my raving, and don't take it personally, but your comments were the last straw for me. If I sounded offencive, I apologise to you and MackemX..
P.S.
Audio selection- removal is on the "to Do" list, but it's unknown if or when will be implemented. But I can live with that.
But then again, Shrink, which you praise so much, leaves all the audio streams "ghosts" in audio selection, a thing that bugs the hell out of me personally, especially with European DVDs with countless Audio and Sub streams. Don't get me wrong: Shrink has often got me out of impossible situations literally, but that doesn't make it 'immune' of improvement.

 

[0xdeadbeef]

Agreed, obviously multiple DVDs can be ripped before processing. The way to do this doesn't seem to be very intuitive to me, but whatever. Still I can't process or analyze the ripped DVD because of the splitted VOBs. Since I need to analyze e.g. sound tracks, I have to do this on the very DVD instead of the ripped files on the HD. So I either have to analyze the DVD directly before of after ripping or I need the DVD again when I decided to analyze it. Both is more effort than working without DVDStripper. If DS makes it a nuisance to analyze the DVD it should provide better tools for this itself. The VTS Selector is a first step, but provides little to no information about the title/chapter etc.

Since processing from the HD seems to be something which is not imlemented for ideological reasons, here some other suggestions to make working with DVDStripper at least a little bit more comfortable:

1) VTS selector should be the default view on the left side. A structured representation of the menus should be provided in the same view. The strange item selector should be a tool instead of the default. Or let the user decide which is the default view.

2) Information about the title could be shown on the right side. Something like play time, audio tracks (!), size of video and audio tracks.
I don't really need audio track removal in DS! It's much more important to get the according information to decide how many extras to rip etc.

3) Allow DVDStripper to select the subdirectory for the current DVD automatically from the DVD title (like DVDDecrypter does) or by creating a unique identifier. Also allow the backup directory to be located automatically inside the temporary folder.
So instead of hacking in 3 paths for every rip one could press a button like "Get Title" and all the paths could be automatically set to a unique subfolder in a given default path.

4) After ripping a DVD, the current path setup etc. should be stored automatically (e.g. by DVD Title) or manually in a "recent projects" menu.
Using the "recent project" selector, one could easily rip multiple DVDs and select them later on with just one click.

 

[MackemX]

I still cannot understand most of your issues regarding previews and why you need to preview audio tracks when DS doesn't even remove audio . Everyone just previews the audio/subs after using DS as it is not a feature and has never been mentioned that it is a feature so how is it extra work?. The simplest method if you want to process later is to tell it the TEMP & DEST paths (you don't even need a backup path as long as it is unticked) and click the rip button. No previews are necessary at all and it's 3 simple steps that would take most users less than a minute

1. the Title selector is laid out numerically just the same as IC or other similar title listing programs, so again I cannot see this as a problem unless people can only use DVDShrink's layout

2. the information about the title is shown. The playback time and amount of chapters are there so again I am confused as to what you are getting at. The only difference I can see to IC is that DS shows chapters but it does not show audio/subs which you even say you don't even need anyway. See attached pic

3. I'm sure most people can manage directing a path to a folder. I myself never use DVDDecrypter default path as it always wants to put it on the wrong HD. You could create a Project folder (similar to Arianos) which you can number for each project and have a TEMP & BACKUP folder in each Project folder

4. If you take a browse through the forums, the project list is on the things to do and in fact if you look at my last reply in this thread I said " In time there will probably be a project option so you just select the project and it will load it all for you", so maybe you overlooked it

basically I think you were expecting DVDStripper to look and work like DVDShrink regarding layout and it's workings yet all the pictures on the site show it is nothing at all similar to DVDShrink . It has also been discussed on the forum regarding the workings. I don't know where you got this impression from or why you keep comparing it to DVDShrink?

I can see most of the points you are making and most have very simple solutions and all are being noted. It's the manner in which you are implying them that is not very friendly to say the least and most have already been discussed and this is how these simple methods have evolved

 

[0xdeadbeef]

I still cannot understand most of your issues regarding previews and why you need to preview audio tracks when DS doesn't even remove audio . Everyone just previews the audio/subs after using DS as it is not a feature and has never been mentioned that it is a feature so how is it extra work?.

Because it's a big difference if there's e.g. a 600MB DTS track that can be removed or not. This influences my decision which extras to remove so I want to see this _before_ using DS.

The simplest method if you want to process later is to tell it the TEMP & DEST paths (you don't even need a backup path as long as it is unticked) and click the rip button. No previews are necessary at all and it's 3 simple steps that would take most users less than a minute

I would still prefer a fast/automatic solution over a slow/manual one.

1. the Title selector is laid out numerically just the same as IC or other similar title listing programs, so again I cannot see this as a problem unless people can only use DVDShrink's layout

The VTS selector is similar to the IC/DVDShrink treeview on the left side, agreed. But that's not the default view. And I still think the "item" list lacks structure and is a bit confusing.

2. the information about the title is shown. The playback time and amount of chapters are there so again I am confused as to what you are getting at. The only difference I can see to IC is that DS shows chapters but it does not show audio/subs which you even say you don't even need anyway. See attached pic

Playback time of the whole title is shown in the VTS selector, right. Didn't deny this. Also I didn't say I wouldn't need information about the audio. In contrary, I said I'd like DS to _show_ the info, but I don't need it to delete audio tracks etc. from within DS. I just suggested to put all the existing and new info in a window on the right (or if you wish: left) side. Having menu items and movie items in two list boxes next to each other is not very conform with typical windows layout and not very intuitive either IMHO.

3. I'm sure most people can manage directing a path to a folder. I myself never use DVDDecrypter default path as it always wants to put it on the wrong HD. You could create a Project folder (similar to Arianos) which you can number for each project and have a TEMP & BACKUP folder in each Project folder

DVDDecrypter's autopath feature works great for me. Of course I can create/select the paths manually, but I would appreciate a more comfortable solution as described.

4. If you take a browse through the forums, the project list is on the things to do and in fact if you look at my last reply in this thread I said " In time there will probably be a project option so you just select the project and it will load it all for you", so maybe you overlooked it

Probably I did.

basically I think you were expecting DVDStripper to look and work like DVDShrink regarding layout and it's workings yet all the pictures on the site show it is nothing at all similar to DVDShrink . It has also been discussed on the forum regarding the workings. I don't know where you got this impression from or why you keep comparing it to DVDShrink?

I also mentioned the similar layout in other programs like IC7/8 and Nero Recode. Indeed this is a typical Windows application layout, so it's not surprising many applications use it.
As I said, I use(d) DVDShrink to analyze ripped DVDs because it has a great layout and is very fast and intuitive. I was not aware that I even _had_ to analyze with DS just because I want to process with DS. From the screenshots I got the impression DS was just a processing tool. Maybe you should consider a limited trial version to avoid misunderstandings.

I can see most of the points you are making and most have very simple solutions and all are being noted. It's the manner in which you are implying them that is not very friendly to say the least and most have already been discussed and this is how these simple methods have evolved

I didn't intend to sound unfriendly. If I did then maybe because I felt it was implied I was not able to understand the function of DS and my suggestions were merely based on this. Furthermore, I'm obviously no native speaker, so forgive me if my English is lacking or sounds harsh from time to time.

 

[MackemX]

#1.Because it's a big difference if there's e.g. a 600MB DTS track that can be removed or not. This influences my decision which extras to remove so I want to see this _before_ using DS.

#2.I would still prefer a fast/automatic solution over a slow/manual one.

#3.The VTS selector is similar to the IC/DVDShrink treeview on the left side, agreed. But that's not the default view. And I still think the "item" list lacks structure and is a bit confusing.

#4.Playback time of the whole title is shown in the VTS selector, right. Didn't deny this. Also I didn't say I wouldn't need information about the audio. In contrary, I said I'd like DS to _show_ the info, but I don't need it to delete audio tracks etc. from within DS. I just suggested to put all the existing and new info in a window on the right (or if you wish: left) side. Having menu items and movie items in two list boxes next to each other is not very conform with typical windows layout and not very intuitive either IMHO.

#5.DVDDecrypter's autopath feature works great for me. Of course I can create/select the paths manually, but I would appreciate a more comfortable solution as described.

#6.Probably I did.

#7.I also mentioned the similar layout in other programs like IC7/8 and Nero Recode. Indeed this is a typical Windows application layout, so it's not surprising many applications use it.

#8.As I said, I use(d) DVDShrink to analyze ripped DVDs because it has a great layout and is very fast and intuitive. I was not aware that I even _had_ to analyze with DS just because I want to process with DS. From the screenshots I got the impression DS was just a processing tool. Maybe you should consider a limited trial version to avoid misunderstandings.

#9.I didn't intend to sound unfriendly. If I did then maybe because I felt it was implied I was not able to understand the function of DS and my suggestions were merely based on this. Furthermore, I'm obviously no native speaker, so forgive me if my English is lacking or sounds harsh from time to time.

#1. Surely if it's a DTS DVD then you are guaranteed to have a 600MB DTS audio file as it will say it's DTS audio on the box. Again you bring DVDShrink into it. I can think of plenty of programs that require you to rip the DVD to look at the audio/subs information so why the big issue?
#2. Does DVDShrink automatically set paths for you?
#3. The items listing is for more advanced users and it is mainly now for the menu items, so you can selectively modify each and every menu. Some are findiing this feature works brilliantly with Menuedit and would hang me if I was to change it. It may be modified in the future to also have a tree view but at the minute it is not top of the to do list
#4. We are not forcing you to use the items listing regarding the movie/extras anymore and the menu items is answered in #3
#5. Truthfully, is it that hard to specify a path? If it is then try this if you want. You do not even have to specify paths. To clear any paths, start DS and then open the browser for any path and immediately close it by clicking Cancel. It shoule now have cleared the path. Clear all 3 or even just the TEMP path. Now click RIP and as long as the path is empty you can keep starting DS and clicking RIP and it will rip to DVDDecrypter's default folder. As long as you do not specify the folder, it's 2 simple clicks to rip a DVD . Try it and confirm it works as I have only asked one other guy but it works for him also. It may specify that the TEMP folder contains files but just click NO when it asks to delete them
#6. Thought so
#7. Nero Recode is DVDShrink. I don't really understand what you mean still reagrding the layout
#8. Did you miss the big SAFC shirt in the ATI DVD player?. Look at step #2 on the DVStripper page again and it will tell you all about it
#9. No worries, but please understand the majority of what you are raising is either displayed on the main DVDStripper page, in the guides or in the forum. I think it's just a simple case of that you have overlooked quite a few things and this is why you are experiencing these beginners difficulties. Let me tell you you are not the first as I have spent many hours online with people talking them through the steps . I'd rather your raised the issues as it may help the next guy who comes along and has issues

 

[Dysmyl]

oxdeadbeef

I've tried to duplicate your errors on my system using the same DVD. I didn't encounter these issues. The fact that I can't replicate the errors however by no means implies that you are not having difficulty. Perhaps there may be some other factors on your system governing these problems?

I feel that your messages are comming across a bit condecending and snippy, I would assume that would be because you feel that you have been talked down to or such and that has put you on the defensive. Trust me when I say that the author respects his customers and will do anything he can to help them. Hell, if he can get this poor thicked headed hillbilly up and running correctly , he can help anyone get sorted out.

 

[MackemX]

Trust me when I say that the author respects his customers and will do anything he can to help them. Hell, if he can get this poor thicked headed hillbilly up and running correctly , he can help anyone get sorted out.

I'm still getting counselling because of you